Shining One

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Posts by Shining One

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  3

  From William Paley.........

  by Shining One in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  a theologian and scientist from darwin's age: .

  "in crossing a heath, suppose i pitched my foot against a stone, and were asked how the stone came to be there; i might possibly answer, that, for anything i knew to the contrary, it had lain there forever: nor would it perhaps be very easy to show the absurdity of this answer.

  but suppose i had found a watch upon the ground, and it should be inquired how the watch happened to be in that place; i should hardly think of the answer which i had before given, that, for anything i knew, the watch might have always been there.

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  Shining One

  A theologian and scientist from Darwin's age:
  "In crossing a heath, suppose I pitched my foot against a stone, and were asked how the stone came to be there; I might possibly answer, that, for anything I knew to the contrary, it had lain there forever: nor would it perhaps be very easy to show the absurdity of this answer. But suppose I had found a watch upon the ground, and it should be inquired how the watch happened to be in that place; I should hardly think of the answer which I had before given, that, for anything I knew, the watch might have always been there. Yet why should not this answer serve for the watch as well as the stone?
  The reason, says Paley, is obvious. A simple examination of the watch leads the mind inexorably forward:
  "The inference, we think, is inevitable; that the watch must have had a maker; that there must have existed, at sometime, and at some place or other, an artificer or artificers, who formed it for the purpose which we find it actually to answer; who comprehended its construction, and designed its use."
  So, too, continues Paley, "all the works of nature, indeed, "every organized natural body" whether plant or animal, simple or complex, likewise leads one inevitably to the conclusion that it too must have a maker.
  For every indication of contrivance. every manifestation of design, which existed in the watch, exists in the works of nature; with the difference, on the side of nature, of being greater and more, and that in degree which exceeds all computation. I mean, that the contrivances of nature surpass the contrivances of art, in the complexity, subtilty, and curiosity of the mechanism; and still more, if possible, do they go beyond them in number and variety."
  Thus, Paley concludes, all the works of nature point to God in the same way that a simple machine points to its human maker.
  
  Indeed, we now know that there are microsopic machines in existence which serve purposes using intricate and unimagiably complicated mechanisms. The 'age of irreducible complexity' is bursting upon a scientific community that is trapped in a contradictory and impossible philosophy. The theories and assertions of the naturalists no longer 'hold water' and only their stubborn resistance to open-minded investigation stands in mankind's way.
  Rex
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  87

  Why Fundyism is Irrational

  by jgnat in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  lately i've been putting a lot of thought in to what is rational and what must be relegated to faith alone.

  ever since the scientific method was discovered, humanity has attempted to put it to work in so many areas.

  after all, discoveries exploded once we were set free from the shackles of tradition.

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  Shining One

  Garybuss,
  That cartoon is an example of the ridiculous notions of the skeptical crowd...
  
  http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/10/98216/1692264/post.ashx#1692264
  Rex
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  8

  Free will?

  by upside/down in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  we are not given the same chance that "adam & eve" were given.... we actually should all be given our own "paradise" planet and the same parameters that were given to them.... we are not...we are born with all sorts of inborn "imperfections" and outside influences...beyond our control.

  so any "test" is a farce.. interesting that the only "perfect" people (jc don't count as he was pseudo-human...he was in the know)...failed....yet supposedly, many of us "imperfects" are successful...how so?.

  "religion" fails to satisfy the truly enquiring mind........again!.

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  Shining One

  >Maybe Adam and Eve didn't fail - maybe what they did was incredible, fantastic, brave and resulted in you and me.
  
  I have one for you. God was not at all suprised by the actions of Adam and Eve. He had a plan to create beings that were not puppets and this had to allow for the existence of evil. Within His plan He would reveal Himself in three ways, redeem makind Himself for the evil that was allowed to exist. None of His created, sentient beings would ever die (immortal soul). No, not even the ones who chose not to worship Him. He prepared a place for each and they would go where they chose to go.
  Rex
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  163

  The Bible...trust in Faith or trust in Fact?

  by jgnat in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i read the most extraordinary claim the other day.

  "the bible is factual.

  " i wondered, how could the speaker possibly back up such a claim?

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  Shining One

  Jgnat,
  'Inerrancy' is the concept that no amount of error is extant in the original, inspired manuscripts. It does not apply to any translation that exists so we have a 'moot point'. It does show a 99.95 accuracy of the harmony where the major texts are compared. With the dead sea scrolls we have some of the Old Testament that goes back to 200 BC and the 'errors' are miniscule. They do not compromise the texts from the 10 and 12th centuries. We actually have more accurate translations now than ever do to the development of scholarship combined with manuscripts being compared. I still caution you that Jesus very much affirmed the teachings in the O.T. and it tis the basis for the N.T. teachings. I wouldn't take it lightly.
  'Infallibility' is the concept that on matters of faith and sound doctrine it is absolutely reliable. This allows for the errors that may exist in historicity and the mundane details. This is where the majority of scholarship resides. The Pope and councils claim this on their decrees. A Evangelical Lutheran pastor would preach that the Genesis accounts are myths (not untruths) that God uses to teach a particular point and must be viewed with the 'Cross' in mind. He would also teach that the texts are inspired through fallible humans and often reflect the human factor as related to the culture (especially in the O.T.). A Southern Baptist pastor would teach that the Bible is inerrant and infallible but would allow for the errors crept into translations, much like Hank Hannegraf teaches. Some churches actually believe the KJV to be 'reinspired' and will use only that translation. That is the extreme fundamentalist position.
  The above examples are in general and not universally true. Each pastor has a particular take on scriipture and line up in their respective camps. Where the essential doctrines of faith are concerned the correct view is to have 'no division' but agreed disagreement in 'grey areas'. My own preference is to give God the benefit of the doubt in each instance until proven other wise; to take text at literal reading until it proves to be otherwise; and always insist on the contextual interpretation. This is something that we all do to some extent naturally and with training it is a real skill to master.
  Rex
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  32

  Who am I thinking of? Question to all

  by Sam the Man in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  who am i describing here: .

  - i am god made flesh, the saviour and the 'son of god' .

  - my father is god and my mother is a mortal virgin.

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  Shining One

  >The notion that the Savior was born on 25 December, for instance, is almost certainly not from the earliest stratum of Christianity.
  
  Leolaia,
  Have you ever considered that the gestation of the Christ child began around that time? Early Christians would have revered the actual conception of Jesus. I seem to remember something about this from tradition in one of my church history classes.
  Rex
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  32

  Who am I thinking of? Question to all

  by Sam the Man in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  who am i describing here: .

  - i am god made flesh, the saviour and the 'son of god' .

  - my father is god and my mother is a mortal virgin.

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  Shining One

  Sam.
  >Interesting points. There are those who believe this region to be where everything escalated from. Why would you think that there is just one region on earth where all other religions/faiths came from?
  
  I believe that those who have studied this can find a common thread although the major faiths seem to have emerged at different times. The easiest ones are the religions that were born out of the 'fertile crescent', which is the cradle of civilization.
  Rex
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  15

  Does a High State of Anxiety...mean you're "spiritual"?...

  by upside/down in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  as a dub i remember everyone in a constant state of high-anxiety...the sky is falling!

  (till they were overcome with some syndrome or depression brought on by this unhealthy debilitating mindset).

  as if that made you worthy of surviving the big a...if and when it came.. if you just lived your life...without anxiety...and the big a arrived...you just "couldn't be worthy".... why?

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  Shining One

  >High Anxiety is a state of mind that naturally follows having a set of "spiritual" values that cannot apply practically to a real world and is the most evident proof that religion is a false comfort and needless waste of time.
  
  T.
  
  Religion is just that. A relationship is far different. This physical realm is not a Christian's home. It is a temporary dwelling, an immortal soul in a physical body that is dying. We are sojourners....
  In His name,
  Rex
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  15

  Does a High State of Anxiety...mean you're "spiritual"?...

  by upside/down in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  as a dub i remember everyone in a constant state of high-anxiety...the sky is falling!

  (till they were overcome with some syndrome or depression brought on by this unhealthy debilitating mindset).

  as if that made you worthy of surviving the big a...if and when it came.. if you just lived your life...without anxiety...and the big a arrived...you just "couldn't be worthy".... why?

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  Shining One

  Dubs are in a high state of anxiety due to a number of factors:
  
  1) They are in a cult as you are alluding to.
  2) There is no 'eternal security' in their theology.
  3) They are not real Christians but 'Jonadabs', only the 144,000 are real Christians.
  4) They have to do mental gymnastics every time the teachings change or flip flop.
  5) They have to suppress all doubt rather than explore and investigate their doubts.
  6) They oftentimes have idiots in charge of congregations.
  Mix and match the above however you want.
  Rex
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  4

  Well, we supernaturalists are not all fundys!

  by Shining One in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  hmmmm, this will have the naturalists spinning like tops....lol .

  http://www.nytimes.com/2005/10/02/weekinreview/02johnson.html?ei=5099&en=4f86677dbc30eb92&ex=1128830400&partner=topixnews&pagewanted=print .

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  Shining One

  Hmmmm, this will have the naturalists spinning like tops....LOL
  http://www.nytimes.com/2005/10/02/weekinreview/02johnson.html?ei=5099&en=4f86677dbc30eb92&ex=1128830400&partner=TOPIXNEWS&pagewanted=print
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  21

  Terry, Leolani: your flat-earth lie is debunked..

  by Shining One in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/10/98216/1692264/post.ashx#1692264 .

  go here then you will find the link.

  enjoy the read.

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  Shining One

  Hi Tetly,
  Have you reserved a bed in the nearest psychiatric ward yet...oops, I forgot. You live in the land of socialized medicine. What takes us three days probably takes you three months...
  Hahhahahhahhahahahhahahhahahahaha
  Rex